End battle over Croft school, says council leader
8:00am Friday 21st September 2012 in Latest News By David Wiles
COUNCIL leader Rod Bluh has urged Croft School campaigners to move on with their lives after it emerged that the council has spent more than £23,750 answering hundreds of public questions on the saga.
The council has dealt with approximately 1,330 recorded questions, including Freedom Of Information requests and public questions at meetings, together with various informal questions, of which the council has not kept detailed records.
They estimate that officers have spent 950 hours dealing with these questions in the last two years, which has impacted on other work. And the council says questions are still coming in about the school, off Marlborough Lane, which opened on September 3.
Coun Bluh (Con, Old Town ) said he did not deny anybody the right to challenge a decision.
And he said he had never said that no mistakes had been made over Croft.
But he feels the unprecedented level of questioning had been disproportionate.
“From my personal experience with the way this whole thing has gone, it’s well over the top,” he said. “Many questions have been repeatedly asked.
“Answers to questions have been given and any reply to virtually any question comes back with further questions.
“Sometimes there has been an unwillingness of people to accept the legitimacy of the answers given, which has been very difficult for members and officers to deal with because it’s effectively an attack on their individual integrity.
“Enough is enough. I would appeal to them to move on. “The decision has been made, the school has been built, the school is now open. What value or purpose is there in continuing it?”
Croft campaigner, Kareen Boyd, of Hesketh Crescent, said: “A confident and effective leader would have chosen to have an open and transparent public consultation on the Croft in 2009.
“It would have been more cost effective to do so. And residents would not have spent thousands of hours and £15,000 on expert advice to understand and assess Swindon Council evidence which has yet to add up.
“When we asked Old Town and Lawn ward councillors, Bawden, Mattock and Foley, questions (i.e, to do their jobs) in September 2010 they told us to DIY.
“As such we had to ask questions about council process as well as the Croft proposal itself.
“As these were either ignored, or the responses were in council speak or didn’t answer the question, further questions had to be asked.
“Does Coun Bluh’s count include these and the ridiculous FoIs the council issued against themselves?
“If Coun Bluh has concerns about costs he must speak to councillors Bawden, Mattock and Foley, as residents had no option but to follow their instructions.
“As leader, Coun Bluh chose not to be open and transparent and the cost and method of his governance is now evident.
“As a consequence, systemic and repeated patterns of behaviour have become apparent, linking a number of projects in Swindon.”
Swindon Council has instigated an independent review into the school’s opening, which will include a public meeting at the Marriott Hotel, off Marlborough Lane, at 6pm on Wednesday, September 26.
Comments(92)
Bobfm ,
says...
9:42am Fri 21 Sep 12
LordAshOfTheBrake
says...
10:25am Fri 21 Sep 12
A straight answer please.
When the councillors involved "move on" out of the council, then I'm sure people will also move on.
PaisleyRed
says...
11:33am Fri 21 Sep 12
1 2 Could B
says...
12:55pm Fri 21 Sep 12
Is that not because questions will always be repeated until an answer is given?
Is Mr Bluh alien to level conversation?
John Smith II
says...
9:31pm Fri 21 Sep 12
Any movement on any of the councillors being held personally responsible for the losses of that project? Particularly any that might have been directors of the company managing it?
Oliver_Donachie
says...
9:02am Sat 22 Sep 12
Sections 9 and 13 of the Freedom of Information Act allow public authorities to charge for answering requests in certain cases.
The Act provides for public authorities to either charge for or decline requests for information that would cost a public authority either more than £600 for central government or £450 for other public authorities to deal with the request.
A public authority can aggregate requests in the following circumstances:
two or more requests for information have been made to the same public authority
they must be either from the same person, or from 'different persons who appear to the public authority to be acting in concert or in pursuance of a campaign'
the requests must relate to the same or similar information
they must have been received by the public authority within a space of 60 consecutive working days
1 2 Could B
says...
9:33am Sat 22 Sep 12
Unfortunately, as with the wifi, they are either answered with "spin" or an offer is made to reply later.
I don't expect a wannabe politician to grasp the politeness of level conversation
CynicRealist
says...
9:48am Sat 22 Sep 12
abbotboy
says...
10:02am Sat 22 Sep 12
abbotboy
says...
10:11am Sat 22 Sep 12
mechanics 600K
Tabernakle stones 330K
Canal report 70K
Fountain 250K
R ONE weekend show 750K
WIFI 400K
Town paving slabs 4.9Million
106 money lost 4 million.
if you now ask questions to people whose job it is, then ask why that lot was wasted........
RichardR1
says...
11:36am Sat 22 Sep 12
abbotboy's list could be much, much longer, how have we ended up with a potentially 9 figure capital deficit, even without the housing debt, in the last 3 years.
abbotboy
says...
12:31pm Sat 22 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie
says...
1:01pm Sat 22 Sep 12
The only point I am making is the flip side of the coin is for all tax payers who know nothing and don't care about Croft school who will ask "why are you wasting 25K of our money answering the same question over and over?"
That is why an FOI officer exists, to strike the balance.
1 2 Could B, still muttering from the shadows? Maybe a new pseudonym "I Could Do Nothing Of Any Importance?"
1 2 Could B
says...
2:42pm Sat 22 Sep 12
abbotboy
says...
3:55pm Sat 22 Sep 12
RichardR1
says...
5:22pm Sat 22 Sep 12
abbotboy
says...
6:07pm Sat 22 Sep 12
he thinks life is grand and everything is rosy, I wonder if he moves to tadpole farm, where his children will go to school until they have 900 houses built, perhaps more children going to the croft by taxi.....
Oliver_Donachie
says...
11:22pm Sat 22 Sep 12
Tadpole:
This so-called ‘Section 106’ agreement has now been finalised,
and amounts to an £11 million pound
package for the local community.
The highlights are:
Primary School – £5m secured for a
new primary school at Tadpole Farm which must be built before 565 houses
are occupied.
Secondary School – £2.7m secured
and ring-fenced for the Northern Sector – in the original agreement this
money could have leaked almost anywhere in the Borough, but northern
sector councillors have successfully argued for it to be ring-fenced
locally.
Open Space – 180 acres of open
space, including playing fields, a £30k nature park, allotments and play
areas, and £167k secured to maintain this open space.
Leisure – £275k investment secured
for local leisure facilities.
Health – land secured for a
Tadpole Farm health centre and set aside for 10 years.
Roads – £212k for improvements to
Thamesdown Drive; £60k for Oakhurst Way, paid before any traffic is to be
sent down it; £10k to improve cycle paths in the Northern Sector; £237,500
for traffic calming on Tadpole Lane.
Public Transport – £750,000 for a
regular local bus service.
Other – £184k for the Fire Service;
£40k for local libraries; £275k for a community facility; £50k for public
art.
Utilities – Essential upgrades to
Haydon Pumping Station must be made before 200 houses are occupied
1 2 Could B
says...
12:34am Sun 23 Sep 12
Hence question and FOIs
Bobfm ,
says...
8:45am Sun 23 Sep 12
Or do all bluh-apologisers adopt the same supercilious tone?
OldTown90
says...
9:59am Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie wrote:Oliver just a couple of points since I sense you are a stickler for fact
CynicRealist,
The only point I am making is the flip side of the coin is for all tax payers who know nothing and don't care about Croft school who will ask "why are you wasting 25K of our money answering the same question over and over?"
That is why an FOI officer exists, to strike the balance.
1 2 Could B, still muttering from the shadows? Maybe a new pseudonym "I Could Do Nothing Of Any Importance?"
1. This cost to answer questions also includes FoIs raised by SBC on SBC . So to lay the total cost at the residents who are entitled to ask questions of the elected is just wrong and a falsehood.
2. Has anyone looked at how much it has cost the council to not answer the questions raised by the residents . Because I'm sure there has been a cost associated with their procrastination and obfuscation. That would be a cost wholly attributable to SBC alone
Like you said earlier there is a flip side to everything
mariusgoring
says...
10:06am Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie wrote:How much did your FOI cost Oliver to get all this information from SBC?
abbotboy , between the caps locks and general rambles its a little hard to decipher any actual English in your posts but I think you are asking where children around the Tadpole farm area will go, not sure what this has to do with FOI's and the cost to the taxpayer but anyway, for those that keep up to date on these things in a weekly and not seasonal manner:
Tadpole:
This so-called ‘Section 106’ agreement has now been finalised,
and amounts to an £11 million pound
package for the local community.
The highlights are:
Primary School – £5m secured for a
new primary school at Tadpole Farm which must be built before 565 houses
are occupied.
Secondary School – £2.7m secured
and ring-fenced for the Northern Sector – in the original agreement this
money could have leaked almost anywhere in the Borough, but northern
sector councillors have successfully argued for it to be ring-fenced
locally.
Open Space – 180 acres of open
space, including playing fields, a £30k nature park, allotments and play
areas, and £167k secured to maintain this open space.
Leisure – £275k investment secured
for local leisure facilities.
Health – land secured for a
Tadpole Farm health centre and set aside for 10 years.
Roads – £212k for improvements to
Thamesdown Drive; £60k for Oakhurst Way, paid before any traffic is to be
sent down it; £10k to improve cycle paths in the Northern Sector; £237,500
for traffic calming on Tadpole Lane.
Public Transport – £750,000 for a
regular local bus service.
Other – £184k for the Fire Service;
£40k for local libraries; £275k for a community facility; £50k for public
art.
Utilities – Essential upgrades to
Haydon Pumping Station must be made before 200 houses are occupied
In July 2010 Councillor Bluh was asked to attend (along with other Council Officials) a meeting convened by Robert Buckland MP. Councillor Bluh refused and forbid anyone else from attending.
This meeting was meant to be an opportunity for Croft residents to ask the sort of questions that have had to be requested by FOI!!
Councillor Bluh is the force for evil in Swindon NOT local residents. He seems to not understand that he is the Public Servant. He can count himself very fortunate that Tony Blair's Government in 2000 remove the Act that would have allowed people like Bluh to be financially persued for wasting Public money.
abbotboy
says...
10:59am Sun 23 Sep 12
1 2 Could B
says...
2:03pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Bobfm , wrote:You were right the fist time
I presume from the arrogant writing style that Oliver donachie is the same person as 20eyes, mr Blackwell etc?
Or do all bluh-apologisers adopt the same supercilious tone?
1 2 Could B
says...
2:06pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Bobfm , wrote:Oops!
I presume from the arrogant writing style that Oliver donachie is the same person as 20eyes, mr Blackwell etc?
Or do all bluh-apologisers adopt the same supercilious tone?
*first* time.
Odd that he now insists we're worthless if we don't all wish to use our real names?
Oliver_Donachie
says...
3:32pm Sun 23 Sep 12
abbotboy, I have no idea, I am not a councilor as you point out, I do however know how to politely ask for information without resorting to slurs and personal attacks and *surprise surprise* people seem to reciprocate. With regards to Bluh's "failure" I have more respect for someone that tries and fails (not that I consider he has) than those that sit around attacking others whilst contributing nothing.
Robert Feal Martinez, I am none of those people listed.
1 2 Could B, I have never said you are worthless I have said you are a spineless coward that sits in the shadows hissing insults, the difference is important as even gutless trolls have some worth in a democracy.
1 2 Could B
says...
3:38pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie
says...
3:49pm Sun 23 Sep 12
With regards to "cleanliness" I think one of the problems with your "lamplighting" process is the fact I have led and utterly boring life of paying taxes, not breaking the law and applying ethics to my work and workplace, that leaves you with nothing to attack me on but the facts and with no metaphorical feces to throw from your cage you become unstuck as arguing on the basis of merit is definitely not your forte.
It is correct that when the council has paid in excess of £25,000 of tax payers money to answer the same question in 50 different ways they draw a line under it , however if that is still not enough for you as the article says:
"Swindon Council has instigated an INDEPENDENT review into the school’s opening, which will include a public meeting at the Marriott Hotel, off Marlborough Lane, at 6pm on Wednesday, September 26"
See you there.
1 2 Could B
says...
3:51pm Sun 23 Sep 12
mariusgoring
says...
3:51pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie wrote:As a member of the public I politely asked SBC for information and was drip fed FOI which took the maximum allowable time to be forthcoming.
mariusgoring, it cost me absolutely nothing, I just went and asked using my actual name instead of screaming from the shadows like a howler monkey that these threads tend to attract.
abbotboy, I have no idea, I am not a councilor as you point out, I do however know how to politely ask for information without resorting to slurs and personal attacks and *surprise surprise* people seem to reciprocate. With regards to Bluh's "failure" I have more respect for someone that tries and fails (not that I consider he has) than those that sit around attacking others whilst contributing nothing.
Robert Feal Martinez, I am none of those people listed.
1 2 Could B, I have never said you are worthless I have said you are a spineless coward that sits in the shadows hissing insults, the difference is important as even gutless trolls have some worth in a democracy.
You are asking me to believe that you simply asked all of the questions that SBC simply gave you the answers above?
I have never met or spoken to Councillor Bluh but he refused to meet me when asked by Robert Buckland MP. Do you still respect an elected Official who ignores and refuses to meet his constituents?
abbotboy
says...
3:53pm Sun 23 Sep 12
mariusgoring
says...
3:55pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie wrote:How Independant do you think this process is going to be? SBC have appointed the panel and are providing ALL clerical assistance.
I Could Do That, I would not even like to think about what you have been doing with your nose around Sweary Bob.
With regards to "cleanliness" I think one of the problems with your "lamplighting" process is the fact I have led and utterly boring life of paying taxes, not breaking the law and applying ethics to my work and workplace, that leaves you with nothing to attack me on but the facts and with no metaphorical feces to throw from your cage you become unstuck as arguing on the basis of merit is definitely not your forte.
It is correct that when the council has paid in excess of £25,000 of tax payers money to answer the same question in 50 different ways they draw a line under it , however if that is still not enough for you as the article says:
"Swindon Council has instigated an INDEPENDENT review into the school’s opening, which will include a public meeting at the Marriott Hotel, off Marlborough Lane, at 6pm on Wednesday, September 26"
See you there.
You really cannot be as stupid as you are coming over Oliver? Noone is that stupid.
abbotboy
says...
3:59pm Sun 23 Sep 12
mariusgoring
says...
4:02pm Sun 23 Sep 12
abbotboy wrote:The temporary school at a cost of £238,000 has been repainted and returned to Swindon and is in use as we speak in North Swindon.
thats a lot of info for the questions you so say asked, I wonder if your 'partner' helped with the task. Perhaps you can ask her if the cost of the groundworks for the croft school wil be included in the overall costs. I wonder if the revamped temporary building has come back from Hull yet?...
I cannot begin to imagine why SBC thinks that it is a good idea to move a temporary school to Hull then spend £238,000 on making it suitable for re-use. Can you?
1 2 Could B
says...
4:06pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Will you be wearing a badge saying
"I luv Rod, please vote for me" ?
abbotboy
says...
4:07pm Sun 23 Sep 12
mariusgoring
says...
4:08pm Sun 23 Sep 12
abbotboy wrote:Bet Oliver cannot answer that one.
OD, as you seem to have all the facts and figures, can you confirm that the three 'independant' people on the review of the croft school, have no ties with SBC at all, even down to their partner etc....
Forgot to mention that the £25,000 spent on answering legitimate questions from local residents seems small beer to the £1,238,000 spent on a hut that house 15 schoolkids for 9 months?
1 2 Could B
says...
4:08pm Sun 23 Sep 12
mariusgoring wrote:North Swindon?
abbotboy wrote:The temporary school at a cost of £238,000 has been repainted and returned to Swindon and is in use as we speak in North Swindon.
thats a lot of info for the questions you so say asked, I wonder if your 'partner' helped with the task. Perhaps you can ask her if the cost of the groundworks for the croft school wil be included in the overall costs. I wonder if the revamped temporary building has come back from Hull yet?...
I cannot begin to imagine why SBC thinks that it is a good idea to move a temporary school to Hull then spend £238,000 on making it suitable for re-use. Can you?
abbotboy
says...
4:17pm Sun 23 Sep 12
1 2 Could B
says...
4:22pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie
says...
4:27pm Sun 23 Sep 12
abbotboy, With regards to being stupid, I did not say anything about the independent review other than it exits, if you consider that stupidity then *shrug*
1 2 Could B, I will be the person not hiding being pseudonymous calling names from the shadows, you can single me out as talking with the other grown ups in a constructive manner.
Anyway, you all seem to be very talented at getting to the bottom of these things, asking important questions in a polite manner so I will leave you to get on with that, good luck.
mariusgoring
says...
4:31pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie wrote:I did ask you a polite question but you seem unable to answer multiple questions.
mariusgoring, it does actually take some time to collate information on top of the persons actual job, if I sent you an FOI asking for the warranty status of every piece of electrical equipment in your home would you not agree it would take at least a day or two to work out? Now extend that over £25,000 worth of FOI's. This is why the architect of the FOI's Tony Blair now accepts the principle of them is correct (as do I) but the application was terrible.
abbotboy, With regards to being stupid, I did not say anything about the independent review other than it exits, if you consider that stupidity then *shrug*
1 2 Could B, I will be the person not hiding being pseudonymous calling names from the shadows, you can single me out as talking with the other grown ups in a constructive manner.
Anyway, you all seem to be very talented at getting to the bottom of these things, asking important questions in a polite manner so I will leave you to get on with that, good luck.
I'll try asking it again. I have never met or spoken to Councillor Bluh but he refused to meet me when asked by Robert Buckland MP. Do you still respect an elected Official who ignores and refuses to meet his constituents?”
abbotboy
says...
4:32pm Sun 23 Sep 12
abbotboy
says...
4:34pm Sun 23 Sep 12
mariusgoring
says...
4:36pm Sun 23 Sep 12
abbotboy wrote:Who is this OD? He seems to be really thick? Not giving a very good defense of Bluh. Of course it is very difficult defending the indefensible.
Youll notice he never answered the question about the review panel, and now he is in a corner, he is leaving...........
abbotboy
says...
4:43pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Grimwald
says...
5:36pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Sadly Rod Bluh does not have either of these qualities!!
And it helps if your apologist on this site lives with a Conservative Councillor!!
Oliver_Donachie
says...
6:21pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Reconcile these two statements:
"I did ask you a polite question but you seem unable to answer multiple questions."
"Who is this OD? He seems to be really thick?"
What part of that makes you think someone will want to answer a question you might have?
And more important why do you think any person in the council would want to "engage" with someone willing to attack a complete stranger who has taken the time to try and at least answer you in some small way.
YOU and the others on this page are the reason YOU have absolutely 0% chance of ever having a meaningful conversation with anyone you want answers from.
Maybe before you roll around on the keyboard frothing out the next attack, you might want to step outside, take a breath, look at the sky and ask yourself "what am I trying to achieve?" and then contemplate if attacking anyone trying to have a meaningful conversation about it , even if you disagree with them is getting you anywhere at all.
Oliver_Donachie
says...
6:30pm Sun 23 Sep 12
You asked:
"I have never met or spoken to Councillor Bluh but he refused to meet me when asked by Robert Buckland MP. Do you still respect an elected Official who ignores and refuses to meet his constituents?”"
My answer is:
I think if Councillor Bluh is able to speak to you and you have a valid concern it is wrong for him not to so in some form.
My caveat being:
I am not in possession of all the facts here and it may be that Councillor Bluh has a valid reason, such as he feels he has already responded, is busy on something, has cat flu. (insert other valid reason)
abbotboy
says...
8:22pm Sun 23 Sep 12
does the three 'independant' members of the review have any connection to the SBC?
the groundworks question, I'll ask at the meeting, if it goes that long....
mariusgoring
says...
8:31pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie wrote:Why don't you ask Robert Buckland the reason Councillor Bluh refused to speak to me? He is in full possession of the facts.
And despite the above I will still attempt to answer your question as best I can.
You asked:
"I have never met or spoken to Councillor Bluh but he refused to meet me when asked by Robert Buckland MP. Do you still respect an elected Official who ignores and refuses to meet his constituents?”"
My answer is:
I think if Councillor Bluh is able to speak to you and you have a valid concern it is wrong for him not to so in some form.
My caveat being:
I am not in possession of all the facts here and it may be that Councillor Bluh has a valid reason, such as he feels he has already responded, is busy on something, has cat flu. (insert other valid reason)
You are in possession of the facts as I have explained to you exactly what happened. This refusal to communicate was in July 2010 which was well before any Planning Application was made for The Croft School. There can be no excuses made for any Councillor who ignores any constituent.
Councillor Bluh is a disgrace to his Office. His total incompetence is there for all to see. He is the reason that so many FOI's have been made. He could have avoided most of the £25,000 expenditure that you are so upset about by simply explaining why a new school was required in Old Town.
He would have struggled, however, as the figures that SBC refused to release are now available. The facts are that if the Croft School had not been built there would be 2 spare places available today at the four existing Old Town Schools. That includes the 48 pupils that are attending who are out of catchment!! No the wonder SBC refused a FOI request for these numbers.
Now Oliver I need you to concentrate. This is a question. Do you believe that Councillor Bluh should have built a new school in Old Town?
Oliver_Donachie
says...
8:40pm Sun 23 Sep 12
mariusgoring,
When you can construct the a question with no petty jibes then I (and I want you to concentrate) will answer your question.
abbotboy
says...
8:42pm Sun 23 Sep 12
OldTown90
says...
9:37pm Sun 23 Sep 12
mariusgoring wrote:Oliver,
abbotboy wrote:Bet Oliver cannot answer that one.
OD, as you seem to have all the facts and figures, can you confirm that the three 'independant' people on the review of the croft school, have no ties with SBC at all, even down to their partner etc....
Forgot to mention that the £25,000 spent on answering legitimate questions from local residents seems small beer to the £1,238,000 spent on a hut that house 15 schoolkids for 9 months?
Why given the acute shortage of school places in the north Swindon did SBC, in your opinion, leave the temporary Croft School empty for 7 months before dismantling it and sending it to North swindon via Hull?
The temporary school was in fact out of commission for a full year before its reappearance in north swindon. Do you, Oliver, think that was waste of money to have a much needed and available resource withheld from the public for a year?
1 2 Could B
says...
9:39pm Sun 23 Sep 12
If I attend the meeting, and you don't bottle out like the "meet you at the mela" scenario, I will also be there using my real name.
Just because you feel that you are above the law, wishing to eke out my undisclosed personal details on these threads, does not diminish my right to use a psuedonym on these threads (as you also do when you're not pretending to be a diplomat)
Unlike yourself I belong to no political party, have no wish to be elected, have no point to prove, and so will continue to use a psuedonym on these threads.
This has nothing to do with cowardice, any more than your brown nosing or arrogance amends the failure of your idols to communicate freely with the electorate
Oliver_Donachie
says...
9:58pm Sun 23 Sep 12
"Why given the acute shortage of school places in the north Swindon did SBC, in your opinion, leave the temporary Croft School empty for 7 months before dismantling it and sending it to North swindon via Hull?"
I don't know, I just dont have any information around that. If the story behind it is as simple as you say then yes its a bad logistic decision.
"The temporary school was in fact out of commission for a full year before its reappearance in north swindon. Do you, Oliver, think that was waste of money to have a much needed and available resource withheld from the public for a year?"
I don't know if it was a waste of money because I don't know what it achieved during its active lifetime. I do know a school is very much needed in the north of Swindon and look forward to the 5.5 Million and 2.2 Million being spent on two of them as soon as possible.
mariusgoring
says...
10:11pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie wrote:Oliver do you believe that Councillor Bluh should have built a new school in Old Town?”
abbotboy, how can I possibly answer that question, how do I know? I have as much information as you have from the article. My guess is no they don't have anything to do with it or it would not be very independent.
mariusgoring,
When you can construct the a question with no petty jibes then I (and I want you to concentrate) will answer your question.
mariusgoring
says...
10:22pm Sun 23 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie wrote:You should know what the temporary school achieved as most people in Swindon know that the maximum number of pupils attending the school was 15!!
OldTown90 ,
"Why given the acute shortage of school places in the north Swindon did SBC, in your opinion, leave the temporary Croft School empty for 7 months before dismantling it and sending it to North swindon via Hull?"
I don't know, I just dont have any information around that. If the story behind it is as simple as you say then yes its a bad logistic decision.
"The temporary school was in fact out of commission for a full year before its reappearance in north swindon. Do you, Oliver, think that was waste of money to have a much needed and available resource withheld from the public for a year?"
I don't know if it was a waste of money because I don't know what it achieved during its active lifetime. I do know a school is very much needed in the north of Swindon and look forward to the 5.5 Million and 2.2 Million being spent on two of them as soon as possible.
Councillor Bluh decided to spend over £1million on providing an education for one academic year to 15 pupils. All of this happened when there were over 90 spare places elsewhere in Swindon.
Of course what the temporary school achieved was that it set a precedant for a building to exist on a green field site. This meant that the temporary school could not be moved until Planning Permission had been granted for a permanent school at Croft.
A really cunning plan don't you think Oliver?
Oliver_Donachie
says...
7:51am Mon 24 Sep 12
My answer is no I don't think the council (its not Rod Bluh's decision alone) should have been built in Old Town as currently a higher demand exists in the northern areas.
However, such a simple answer does not do you, the council or Mr Bluh service as its far more complex than that, so let me expand on it.
Before I do I would just like to say:
1: I dont have any special information other than data taken from locality meetings and governors meetings.
2: Its my opinion and is probably wrong in many places, I just dont have all the information.
So....
My answer is no I don't think the council should have been built in Old Town based on the information we have as of the 24/09/2012.
In 2009 I looked at a graph and a small report that extrapolated school placements for the area of "Old Town and the surrounding schools" (that part is important) through to 2017, the summary is requirements builds till 2015 and then tails off a little but the reality is the report begins to simply gaze into a crystal ball, nobody really knew then and you would get the same results now. What was entirely clear then in 2009 was a shortfall in places existed by 2012 -14 if nothing corrective was done.
For reference the chart is here : http://snag.gy/HkoT6
.jpg
We may have different data now (although I am not sure we actually do) but the decision had to be taken on those numbers at that time.
At this point people begin scratching chins and pondering where to place a school, and I believe the logic behind croft went something like this:
A: It already had planning permission to exist, contentious I know, but it did.
B: The requirements for school placements was known across an area described as "Old Town and surrounding schools" therefore building in the epicenter meant that in the absolute worse case scenario any student has a roughly equal distance to travel from the circumference of the catchment area, I appreciate this is not a geographical absolute but it does make a kind of sense.
To finalize my answer, I believe that as we move through 2013 - 2016 it will be proven that the students of Swindon need not only the Croft but the additional (now founded) Schools in the northern sector as well, and even if that provision is made pressure will exist on the system.
This view is not based on any political ideology, pressure from Nimby's or the whispers from the council. its based on empirical, independent evidence we have from data sources.
mariusgoring
says...
10:06am Mon 24 Sep 12
I also saw in 2009 the following information given by Gareth Cheal (SBC employee) The Dfe awarded £6,374m to SBC in 2009 on the basis of predicted 2011 need in North Swindon (295) Central Swindon (173) and Old Town (13). So Councillor Bluh lied to the DfE to obtain the money to build a new school at Croft.
Do you agree Oliver?
abbotboy
says...
10:10am Mon 24 Sep 12
abbotboy
says...
10:10am Mon 24 Sep 12
Grimwald
says...
10:19am Mon 24 Sep 12
Thank you for pointing out that you through your connections are having to protect this money against Rod Bluh and his Cabinet spending it all in their own wards just like they did with the Croft etc.
Meanwhile please keep highlighting the scandalous behaviour of your friends, it is most enlightening.
abbotboy
says...
10:29am Mon 24 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie
says...
12:08pm Mon 24 Sep 12
abbotboy, I was thinking it was worth trying to at least present publicly available information but yours and others complete inability to conduct yourselves without resorting to personal abuse suggest I am better off leaving you to rot in a pool of disinformation, it is absolutely no surprise to me now why anyone in authority sits behind a wall of silence.
Do yourself a favor, and I mean this genuinely, read what you have posted, do you think any normal person is going to actually take part in that?
mariusgoring
says...
12:28pm Mon 24 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie wrote:The word you are looking for is THEIR not THERE. Perhaps The Croft School is needed. There are plenty of places for you.
mariusgoring, you seem willing and able to discuss things based on facts so feel free to pop me a message, I cant be bothered to filter out all the trolling and would rather leave these people to carry on with there ever so effective methods of "engagement"
abbotboy, I was thinking it was worth trying to at least present publicly available information but yours and others complete inability to conduct yourselves without resorting to personal abuse suggest I am better off leaving you to rot in a pool of disinformation, it is absolutely no surprise to me now why anyone in authority sits behind a wall of silence.
Do yourself a favor, and I mean this genuinely, read what you have posted, do you think any normal person is going to actually take part in that?
As Bluh has not included the groundwork costs in his overspent budget I think that abbotboy is asking you a reasonable question and you should answer it. Don't you?
1 2 Could B
says...
12:41pm Mon 24 Sep 12
I might wear a Tshirt with "Oliver Dognasty says 13 yrs of Labour Blah Blah Blah" written on it
Bobfm ,
says...
1:39pm Mon 24 Sep 12
1 2 Could B
says...
6:03pm Mon 24 Sep 12
RichardR1
says...
6:24pm Mon 24 Sep 12
I suspect though that the key board warriors will not have the courage.
I note that Oliver has been misled by the Bobfm character believing it is Robert Feal-Martinez, even the usual trolls know it isn't but don't even have the integrity to put him right on that small point.
Bobfm ,
says...
8:04pm Mon 24 Sep 12
Oliver_Donachie
says...
9:45pm Mon 24 Sep 12
1 2 Could B
says...
11:48pm Mon 24 Sep 12
Bobfm ,
says...
8:43am Tue 25 Sep 12
RichardR1
says...
9:16am Tue 25 Sep 12
But of course I could be wrong.
abbotboy
says...
10:03am Tue 25 Sep 12
Bobfm ,
says...
10:44am Tue 25 Sep 12
RichardR1 wrote:You usually are
I had heard Bobfm on here is a person who has a personal gripe against the Council/Councillors because he was ordered to remove illegal hoardings, and now plagues the Council by reporting others, who have them even though for some of these planning permission isn't required due to the time they have been in place.
But of course I could be wrong.
RichardR1
says...
11:03am Tue 25 Sep 12
Bobfm, it was a legal disclaimer, my sources are pretty reliable.
1 2 Could B
says...
7:36pm Tue 25 Sep 12
RichardR1
says...
7:58pm Tue 25 Sep 12
I am sure the Adver are more than aware how once again a well debated thread was dragged down.
Bobfm ,
says...
9:53pm Tue 25 Sep 12
1 2 Could B
says...
9:55pm Tue 25 Sep 12
1 2 Could B
says...
10:05pm Tue 25 Sep 12
Surely The Adver don't give Robfm warnings?
No, of course they don't which is why you're now logged in as RichardR1 and having a grande finale, before going off to Portsmouth.
When you're gone, the new tenants will probably have a full house with all of us toasting your departure
RichardR1
says...
8:30am Wed 26 Sep 12
As for the rest of the waffle, just a little expression to ponder on.
Perhaps, 'the devil you know'.
As I understand it the new tenants are very experienced and will not let anyone tell them how they should run their business, and will certainly not seek or take advice from the trolls, who they have been briefed on.
As for being full, highly likely it's the Lemming instinct, everyone likes to be able to say I've been there when a pub either changes hands or is a new build.
It is what is happening 9 months down the line that matters.
Bobfm ,
says...
10:14am Wed 26 Sep 12
And why post under the name Richard when you are so critical of others who you suggest post under names other than their own?
RichardR1
says...
12:07pm Wed 26 Sep 12
Once more I am not moving to Portsmouth and never was.
Bobfm ,
says...
4:23pm Wed 26 Sep 12
RichardR1
says...
11:13am Thu 27 Sep 12
Bobfm ,
says...
3:57pm Thu 27 Sep 12
RichardR1
says...
9:08am Fri 28 Sep 12
Bobfm ,
says...
12:25pm Fri 28 Sep 12
Al Smith says...
8:56am Fri 21 Sep 12
I've got one question - If E. Wichel primary has unfilled places and Central and North Swindon desperately lack primary school places why build a new school just up the road (less than 1 mile) from E. Wichel primary?