Ambitious £350m plans for town centre's future

This Is Wiltshire: Fleming Way is earmarked for a major transformation as shown in this artist's impression Fleming Way is earmarked for a major transformation as shown in this artist's impression

THE next stage of the £350 million Kimmerfields development was fully revealed yesterday with hopes high it will result in a major boost for the town.

Following the completion of the Whalebridge car park last year, the second phase will see Fleming Way lowered down to the same level as the rest of the town centre, thereby getting rid of the underpass near Debenhams.

The road will become a single carriage east to west bus route and will house a brand new bus inter-change, with an open public space on the available space subsequently created.

On the site of the current bus station and adjacent car park, office space will be built providing upwards of 3,500 new jobs and 450 new apartments, along with shops and restaurants.

The council, Forward Swindon and developers MUSE believe the development is a natural progression for the development of the town centre.

Ian Piper, the Chief Executive of Forward Swindon, said: “I am excited about Kimmerfields because it is a big development which will transform the town centre.

“When you take into account the extra jobs and restaurants, all the extra spending power will have huge economic benefits for the town.

“Fleming Way has always acted as a natural barrier for the town centre which this development will remove. We have spoken with staff from Zurich who have said the entrance way to the town centre through the underpass has in the past put them off from coming in.

“It is not just about building up this part of the town but the whole of the town centre.”

The diggers are not set to move in until 2016 and then the full development will be carried out in stages so it is unlikely to be completed for more than a decade.

Currently, the necessary work is being done behind the scenes involving the compulsory purchase of certain bits of land and applications to close the road.

The Development Director at MUSE, Doug Finlay, said: “This is a small step towards an organic growth of the town centre. The council administration have seen an opportunity and have taken it with both hands.

“I think when Fleming Way was first built it was because it was where people saw the town centre ending but I think that has now changed and the only natural direction for it is to move it north.

“We can’t do everything at once otherwise we will strangle the town centre so we will carry it out in stages. This is an example of the town centre fighting back.”

There have been some concerns raised that stopping traffic from using Fleming Way will cause trouble on other roads.

Coun Garry Perkins (Con, Shaw), the cabinet member for regeneration, said: “This is not about trying to stop cars getting into the town centre. Routes have been made for people to take and we are expanding the capacity of roads elsewhere so people getting across the town will not have to drive through the town centre.

“There is likely to be some problems for some people as we are shifting a major through route but we have two years in which to discuss solutions with residents and ward councillors.

“I am expecting some good ideas to come out in that time and we’ll see if it is possible to implement them.”

KIMMERFIELDS DEVELOPMENT FACTFILE

  • Currently, Swindon Council is preparing to take action to ensure the Kimmerfields development can proceed as planned.
  • A request to issue a compulsory purchase order to buy several pockets of land around the proposed site will allow developers to move forward with the proposal.
  • There are nine areas in total and although most of the sites are small pieces of land with no buildings, one of the sites is next to the underpass near Debenhams and includes the Greggs and the Cornish Bakehouse shops.
  • If the CPO goes ahead, compensation will be available to ensure the development goes ahead. For this just over £1.6 million has been set aside.
  • Talks are ongoing with landowners to negotiate the deal but the CPO is being recommended in order to ensure everything can go ahead before a deadline in May this year.
  • If the council does not have control of the land by then, the deal with Muse Developments will be under threat, although the deadline is expected to be extended.

Comments (47)

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8:46am Thu 6 Mar 14

Al Smith says...

When are MUSE going to actually build something using their own money?

Everything done so far appears to have been paid for through the public purse. Crony capitalism?
When are MUSE going to actually build something using their own money? Everything done so far appears to have been paid for through the public purse. Crony capitalism? Al Smith
  • Score: 18

9:20am Thu 6 Mar 14

Wildwestener says...

Utter rubbish. All I see here is public money subsidising private development and ultimately profit. The Swindon taxpayer pays for this and then can't get through the town centre because the developers want to keep traffic away so they can make a bigger buck.
Where are all these jobs coming from by the way; plenty of exmpty office space in Swindon not filled. Just because you build offices, it doesn't mean jobs.
As I said, utter rubbish
Utter rubbish. All I see here is public money subsidising private development and ultimately profit. The Swindon taxpayer pays for this and then can't get through the town centre because the developers want to keep traffic away so they can make a bigger buck. Where are all these jobs coming from by the way; plenty of exmpty office space in Swindon not filled. Just because you build offices, it doesn't mean jobs. As I said, utter rubbish Wildwestener
  • Score: 28

9:22am Thu 6 Mar 14

Arrowfield says...

believe it when I see it. So far we have a couple of office blocks and a new car park that looks empty most of the time. Looks like most of the money is going towards straightening out the bizarre road system in the town centre.
believe it when I see it. So far we have a couple of office blocks and a new car park that looks empty most of the time. Looks like most of the money is going towards straightening out the bizarre road system in the town centre. Arrowfield
  • Score: 9

9:41am Thu 6 Mar 14

swindondad says...

I all SOUNDS very nice but will many / any of us live long enough to see it completed?

Even the "best guess" figure quoted in the article say it's more than a dozen years away and as we know most big projects end up "late and over budget".

N.B. Personally I do not see any pent up demand for either office space or more flats so I doubt the financial feasibility of the project.
I all SOUNDS very nice but will many / any of us live long enough to see it completed? Even the "best guess" figure quoted in the article say it's more than a dozen years away and as we know most big projects end up "late and over budget". N.B. Personally I do not see any pent up demand for either office space or more flats so I doubt the financial feasibility of the project. swindondad
  • Score: 15

9:47am Thu 6 Mar 14

Street1234 says...

I just have one quick question

If Fleming way going to be buses only how are businesses like BHS, River Island etc going to get deliveries ?
Going down Fleming way and turning left at the bottom is the only way to get to the back of these shops & businesses

Does anyone know?
I just have one quick question If Fleming way going to be buses only how are businesses like BHS, River Island etc going to get deliveries ? Going down Fleming way and turning left at the bottom is the only way to get to the back of these shops & businesses Does anyone know? Street1234
  • Score: 12

9:51am Thu 6 Mar 14

stratton man says...

Maybe we will see a better class of wino in the town centre when its completed.
Maybe we will see a better class of wino in the town centre when its completed. stratton man
  • Score: 9

9:51am Thu 6 Mar 14

Swindon_AOK says...

The biggest disappointment for me is the timescales.

They have had 10 years since this was first proposed to get the necessary CPOS and land accumulation done.

They started knocking down the old police station to build the new car park and flats years ago. Why are we up against Muse's deadline to complete the CPOs? Why is it taking so long?

Why does it have to be a phased implementation or strangle the town centre?

These are valid questions and I can't help thinking the real reason for the delay is simply that there is no demand for this scheme. I am pretty sure that behind the scenes the council and Muse are worried that there is no still no demand from the private sector for office space in the town centre. Without a significant pre-let I don't think Muse want to take the risk to build the scheme.

It feels like they are buying themselves more time to secure something, and if they do not then don't be surprised to see that everything collapses and Muse pull out.

I'm pretty sure their back up plan is to move the Council offices into Kimmerfields and achieve 'regeneration' by shifting workers from one location to the other, as opposed to genuine game-changing new investment.

What we need is for Nationwide or an HSBC to relocate to the scheme thereby generating the genuine new jobs and fuelling demand for retail to open. WIthout that the future of this scheme seems in doubt and will only ever be an incremental step towards regeneration rather than the big bang that actually is sorely needed.

Ultimately nothing new here, just another regurgitation of stories from bygone years....
The biggest disappointment for me is the timescales. They have had 10 years since this was first proposed to get the necessary CPOS and land accumulation done. They started knocking down the old police station to build the new car park and flats years ago. Why are we up against Muse's deadline to complete the CPOs? Why is it taking so long? Why does it have to be a phased implementation or strangle the town centre? These are valid questions and I can't help thinking the real reason for the delay is simply that there is no demand for this scheme. I am pretty sure that behind the scenes the council and Muse are worried that there is no still no demand from the private sector for office space in the town centre. Without a significant pre-let I don't think Muse want to take the risk to build the scheme. It feels like they are buying themselves more time to secure something, and if they do not then don't be surprised to see that everything collapses and Muse pull out. I'm pretty sure their back up plan is to move the Council offices into Kimmerfields and achieve 'regeneration' by shifting workers from one location to the other, as opposed to genuine game-changing new investment. What we need is for Nationwide or an HSBC to relocate to the scheme thereby generating the genuine new jobs and fuelling demand for retail to open. WIthout that the future of this scheme seems in doubt and will only ever be an incremental step towards regeneration rather than the big bang that actually is sorely needed. Ultimately nothing new here, just another regurgitation of stories from bygone years.... Swindon_AOK
  • Score: 9

10:19am Thu 6 Mar 14

KeyboardWarri0r says...

The artist's impression looks lovely. Shame the reality will be graffiti, chavs with their dogs and drunks.
The artist's impression looks lovely. Shame the reality will be graffiti, chavs with their dogs and drunks. KeyboardWarri0r
  • Score: 12

11:08am Thu 6 Mar 14

Robh says...

Where did they get that name. I thought the area was called Regents Circus.
Where did they get that name. I thought the area was called Regents Circus. Robh
  • Score: -6

11:10am Thu 6 Mar 14

StillPav says...

it does seem very strange that businesses are increasingly re-locating out of the town centre to out-of-town offices, while at the same time there are plans to build thousands of sqaure feet of new office space in town.
it does seem very strange that businesses are increasingly re-locating out of the town centre to out-of-town offices, while at the same time there are plans to build thousands of sqaure feet of new office space in town. StillPav
  • Score: 10

11:45am Thu 6 Mar 14

silvergran says...

I'm sure there are plenty of empty office spaces in the town already - where are these people going to come from to magically fill the buildings? I hope they build a decent bus station instead of the disgraceful one we have now - the one in Bristol is very nice, but I can't see them giving us one like that, it'd be full of the drunks messing everything up.
I'm sure there are plenty of empty office spaces in the town already - where are these people going to come from to magically fill the buildings? I hope they build a decent bus station instead of the disgraceful one we have now - the one in Bristol is very nice, but I can't see them giving us one like that, it'd be full of the drunks messing everything up. silvergran
  • Score: 5

11:55am Thu 6 Mar 14

GrumpyLocal says...

The plan to close Flemming way to normal traffic is fine in isolation. However, other regeneration plans have detailed the singling of Princess St in to a 2-way road thus removing capacity whilst the new development at the college site is also going to reduce traffic flow from the est coming in to the town centre. Unless the council is planning on building NEW roads into the centre from the east there is going to be either gridlock or people are going to head north or south to Cirencester, Cheltenham or Marlborough for their shopping instead.
The work carried out on Princess St & Flemming Way has already had the effect of removing traffic flow from those areas (a stat that the council will no doubt use as justification to close Flemming way "as it is used little by normal traffic" thus having little effect on traffic flow) & placing the additional volumes on to Groundwell Road and surrounding area & then routes through Old Town instead.
In addition to the work in the town centre there also plans to reduce the traffic flow through Old Town (passing the Corn Exchange) which will again have an impact on traffic flow and people desire to come into the centre of Swindon.
Whilst everyone likes to see progress as far as improving the town centre, it seems counter productive to do this at the expense of making access to it even harder.
The plan to close Flemming way to normal traffic is fine in isolation. However, other regeneration plans have detailed the singling of Princess St in to a 2-way road thus removing capacity whilst the new development at the college site is also going to reduce traffic flow from the est coming in to the town centre. Unless the council is planning on building NEW roads into the centre from the east there is going to be either gridlock or people are going to head north or south to Cirencester, Cheltenham or Marlborough for their shopping instead. The work carried out on Princess St & Flemming Way has already had the effect of removing traffic flow from those areas (a stat that the council will no doubt use as justification to close Flemming way "as it is used little by normal traffic" thus having little effect on traffic flow) & placing the additional volumes on to Groundwell Road and surrounding area & then routes through Old Town instead. In addition to the work in the town centre there also plans to reduce the traffic flow through Old Town (passing the Corn Exchange) which will again have an impact on traffic flow and people desire to come into the centre of Swindon. Whilst everyone likes to see progress as far as improving the town centre, it seems counter productive to do this at the expense of making access to it even harder. GrumpyLocal
  • Score: 9

12:09pm Thu 6 Mar 14

GrumpyLocal says...

Street1234 wrote:
I just have one quick question

If Fleming way going to be buses only how are businesses like BHS, River Island etc going to get deliveries ?
Going down Fleming way and turning left at the bottom is the only way to get to the back of these shops & businesses

Does anyone know?
The access to these shops is carried out via College St & John St, Both of which should still be accessible for deliveries.
[quote][p][bold]Street1234[/bold] wrote: I just have one quick question If Fleming way going to be buses only how are businesses like BHS, River Island etc going to get deliveries ? Going down Fleming way and turning left at the bottom is the only way to get to the back of these shops & businesses Does anyone know?[/p][/quote]The access to these shops is carried out via College St & John St, Both of which should still be accessible for deliveries. GrumpyLocal
  • Score: 1

12:13pm Thu 6 Mar 14

GrumpyLocal says...

Having looked at the artist impressions which can be found at http://goo.gl/qVUtyf 9 (thanks for giving us this info Adver!) I am amazed to see that the Debenhams building and the unused, derelict office block above is still there. This cannot be right, they are both eyesores.
Having looked at the artist impressions which can be found at http://goo.gl/qVUtyf 9 (thanks for giving us this info Adver!) I am amazed to see that the Debenhams building and the unused, derelict office block above is still there. This cannot be right, they are both eyesores. GrumpyLocal
  • Score: 4

12:28pm Thu 6 Mar 14

StillPav says...

A LOT of artistic licence has been used in those images. In #6 the magistrates court seem to have disappeared, as have the traffic lights on Princes Street!
A LOT of artistic licence has been used in those images. In #6 the magistrates court seem to have disappeared, as have the traffic lights on Princes Street! StillPav
  • Score: 1

12:49pm Thu 6 Mar 14

trustnopolitician says...

Lets get some decent councillors in power ( any political colour) and then maybe this sort of nonsene would stop. Town centres are a thing of the past and housing should replace the outdated centres we have now.

Bookies, take aways , charity shops and poundland seem to make up the majority of Town Centres incliuding Swindon and most people do their day to day shopping in "out of Town " sites
Lets get some decent councillors in power ( any political colour) and then maybe this sort of nonsene would stop. Town centres are a thing of the past and housing should replace the outdated centres we have now. Bookies, take aways , charity shops and poundland seem to make up the majority of Town Centres incliuding Swindon and most people do their day to day shopping in "out of Town " sites trustnopolitician
  • Score: 3

1:31pm Thu 6 Mar 14

stfcdod says...

There is one word that describes all of this and York and Manchester already have an area so called..............
..............SHAMBL
ES.
There is one word that describes all of this and York and Manchester already have an area so called.............. ..............SHAMBL ES. stfcdod
  • Score: 7

1:55pm Thu 6 Mar 14

house on the hill says...

A recent article summed it up very well. High streets are now the 5 "B's", Burgers, Barista's, Betting, Bargains or Boarded up! More people now work in coffee shops than are employed by the British Army! Why we are continuing to spend on something clearly terminal seems a big waste of money, but I guess that is the one thing our Council are top of the list for being good at!
A recent article summed it up very well. High streets are now the 5 "B's", Burgers, Barista's, Betting, Bargains or Boarded up! More people now work in coffee shops than are employed by the British Army! Why we are continuing to spend on something clearly terminal seems a big waste of money, but I guess that is the one thing our Council are top of the list for being good at! house on the hill
  • Score: 5

1:59pm Thu 6 Mar 14

John~R says...

650,000sq.ft of office space! Potential business tenants would think carefully before signing up to occupying a building in an area where road access is being deliberately downgraded.

Perhaps some blocks of flats would make more sense. The proximity to the station would give the option to catch the train to where the work is.
650,000sq.ft of office space! Potential business tenants would think carefully before signing up to occupying a building in an area where road access is being deliberately downgraded. Perhaps some blocks of flats would make more sense. The proximity to the station would give the option to catch the train to where the work is. John~R
  • Score: 6

4:22pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Always Grumpy says...

Robh wrote:
Where did they get that name. I thought the area was called Regents Circus.
Wrong development.
[quote][p][bold]Robh[/bold] wrote: Where did they get that name. I thought the area was called Regents Circus.[/p][/quote]Wrong development. Always Grumpy
  • Score: 0

4:41pm Thu 6 Mar 14

DLP OldTown says...

Believe it when I see it, if it should by any chance happen then more misery is around the corner for anyone coming in or going out of the town. Why don't Swindon Highways and planners visit a few large towns in the Country to see how it should be done.
Love the artists impression but somehow don't think it will look the same in reality......we can but hope.
Believe it when I see it, if it should by any chance happen then more misery is around the corner for anyone coming in or going out of the town. Why don't Swindon Highways and planners visit a few large towns in the Country to see how it should be done. Love the artists impression but somehow don't think it will look the same in reality......we can but hope. DLP OldTown
  • Score: 2

5:30pm Thu 6 Mar 14

barlizard says...

Is this the same development they were talking about when the old post office was closed? Can't remember! It was that long ago!!
Is this the same development they were talking about when the old post office was closed? Can't remember! It was that long ago!! barlizard
  • Score: 3

5:46pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Wildwestener says...

Hope our Councillors are reading these ringing endorsements of their latest vanity project.

How about we stop spending money on these white elephants
Hope our Councillors are reading these ringing endorsements of their latest vanity project. How about we stop spending money on these white elephants Wildwestener
  • Score: 3

5:52pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Swindon_AOK says...

barlizard wrote:
Is this the same development they were talking about when the old post office was closed? Can't remember! It was that long ago!!
Sadly yes - sort of. Old post office was going to be another block of flats but that got killed by the recession. This is a much more ambitious scheme but by that read another 10-15 years before that site is completed
[quote][p][bold]barlizard[/bold] wrote: Is this the same development they were talking about when the old post office was closed? Can't remember! It was that long ago!![/p][/quote]Sadly yes - sort of. Old post office was going to be another block of flats but that got killed by the recession. This is a much more ambitious scheme but by that read another 10-15 years before that site is completed Swindon_AOK
  • Score: 2

5:57pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Dickdock says...

Flogging a dead horse,
As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses,
I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!!
Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store
SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves,
Free wifi anyone!!!!!!
I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this,
With the tax payers payers footing the bill
Flogging a dead horse, As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses, I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!! Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves, Free wifi anyone!!!!!! I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this, With the tax payers payers footing the bill Dickdock
  • Score: 4

6:01pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Swindon_AOK says...

GrumpyLocal wrote:
Having looked at the artist impressions which can be found at http://goo.gl/qVUtyf 9 (thanks for giving us this info Adver!) I am amazed to see that the Debenhams building and the unused, derelict office block above is still there. This cannot be right, they are both eyesores.
I'd missed that image. It does seem shocking that Section 28 money / developer bribe fund cannot be set aside to re-face that building.

Knocking it down would require a very expensive CPO due to Debenhams being the tenant.

Did you know the chance to lose that building died with the Westfield shopping centre proposal? Because Debenhams had signed up as key anchor for that scheme they would have had somewhere to go once it was demolished. Without a home to go to that building is here to stay and who will pay to refurbish the uppoer floors where the junkies hang out - they are probaly beyond repair at this point.

I still see nothing in that artists impression of fleming way to be confident that the are would be have life after 5PM. It looks another urban wasteland once the shops shut and still not particularly attractive. Even the new buildings shown are 'striking' as opposed to aesthetically pleasing......
[quote][p][bold]GrumpyLocal[/bold] wrote: Having looked at the artist impressions which can be found at http://goo.gl/qVUtyf 9 (thanks for giving us this info Adver!) I am amazed to see that the Debenhams building and the unused, derelict office block above is still there. This cannot be right, they are both eyesores.[/p][/quote]I'd missed that image. It does seem shocking that Section 28 money / developer bribe fund cannot be set aside to re-face that building. Knocking it down would require a very expensive CPO due to Debenhams being the tenant. Did you know the chance to lose that building died with the Westfield shopping centre proposal? Because Debenhams had signed up as key anchor for that scheme they would have had somewhere to go once it was demolished. Without a home to go to that building is here to stay and who will pay to refurbish the uppoer floors where the junkies hang out - they are probaly beyond repair at this point. I still see nothing in that artists impression of fleming way to be confident that the are would be have life after 5PM. It looks another urban wasteland once the shops shut and still not particularly attractive. Even the new buildings shown are 'striking' as opposed to aesthetically pleasing...... Swindon_AOK
  • Score: 2

6:07pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Swindon_AOK says...

Also anyone see Reading are getting another £500m redevelopment of their town centre. 15 years after regeneration was proposed in Swindon and we are only just about to get a half-baked cinema and bars development. We didn't even get the Oracle-type shopping development that was promised, with the cinema anchoring a rejuvenated Brunel Centre. Personally I think that's where the cinema should have gone, driving some nightime traffic to the town centre. Instead we have a new hub at the top of town but nothing to drive reinvestment into the dying core. This whole Kimmerfields scheme will do nothing to rejuvenate the rest of the town centre unless they get a major new employer to come in.
Also anyone see Reading are getting another £500m redevelopment of their town centre. 15 years after regeneration was proposed in Swindon and we are only just about to get a half-baked cinema and bars development. We didn't even get the Oracle-type shopping development that was promised, with the cinema anchoring a rejuvenated Brunel Centre. Personally I think that's where the cinema should have gone, driving some nightime traffic to the town centre. Instead we have a new hub at the top of town but nothing to drive reinvestment into the dying core. This whole Kimmerfields scheme will do nothing to rejuvenate the rest of the town centre unless they get a major new employer to come in. Swindon_AOK
  • Score: 5

6:17pm Thu 6 Mar 14

madreeves says...

The level of negativity aimed at anything in this town is really extraordinary. And always the same people banging on about the same things all the time and desperately trying to make out there are ulterior motives for everything. Moan, moan, moan. GOD, YOU'RE ALL SOOOOO BORING!!! Why can't you just see this as a regeneration of a horrible, unsafe part of town into something better for the future, instead of all being armchair critics, piously sitting in your ivory towers, smugly spewing self-righteous opinionated drivel and lambasting projects before they even get underway? Anyone going to drag up the wi fi issue and try and crowbar it in here??? No, that scheme didn't work but, then, a few individuals made it their personal ambition not to allow it to work didn't they? No wonder this site only has about 6 people who regularly post (and even those can't get through a debate without resorting to pathetic little tit for tat spats amongst themselves). Any idea how boring it is to have to trawl past your playground c**p to find someone with something intelligent to say? No doubt you'll all pounce on this with a response that's either a) totally patronising b) plain rude or c) totally irrelevant. Well, huff and puff away and "fiddle those thumbs" (as most of you accuse each other of doing - it's so obvious many of you have multiple logons - duh!). I, for one, won't even bother to read it.
The level of negativity aimed at anything in this town is really extraordinary. And always the same people banging on about the same things all the time and desperately trying to make out there are ulterior motives for everything. Moan, moan, moan. GOD, YOU'RE ALL SOOOOO BORING!!! Why can't you just see this as a regeneration of a horrible, unsafe part of town into something better for the future, instead of all being armchair critics, piously sitting in your ivory towers, smugly spewing self-righteous opinionated drivel and lambasting projects before they even get underway? Anyone going to drag up the wi fi issue and try and crowbar it in here??? No, that scheme didn't work but, then, a few individuals made it their personal ambition not to allow it to work didn't they? No wonder this site only has about 6 people who regularly post (and even those can't get through a debate without resorting to pathetic little tit for tat spats amongst themselves). Any idea how boring it is to have to trawl past your playground c**p to find someone with something intelligent to say? No doubt you'll all pounce on this with a response that's either a) totally patronising b) plain rude or c) totally irrelevant. Well, huff and puff away and "fiddle those thumbs" (as most of you accuse each other of doing - it's so obvious many of you have multiple logons - duh!). I, for one, won't even bother to read it. madreeves
  • Score: -1

6:29pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Dickdock says...

madreeves wrote:
The level of negativity aimed at anything in this town is really extraordinary. And always the same people banging on about the same things all the time and desperately trying to make out there are ulterior motives for everything. Moan, moan, moan. GOD, YOU'RE ALL SOOOOO BORING!!! Why can't you just see this as a regeneration of a horrible, unsafe part of town into something better for the future, instead of all being armchair critics, piously sitting in your ivory towers, smugly spewing self-righteous opinionated drivel and lambasting projects before they even get underway? Anyone going to drag up the wi fi issue and try and crowbar it in here??? No, that scheme didn't work but, then, a few individuals made it their personal ambition not to allow it to work didn't they? No wonder this site only has about 6 people who regularly post (and even those can't get through a debate without resorting to pathetic little tit for tat spats amongst themselves). Any idea how boring it is to have to trawl past your playground c**p to find someone with something intelligent to say? No doubt you'll all pounce on this with a response that's either a) totally patronising b) plain rude or c) totally irrelevant. Well, huff and puff away and "fiddle those thumbs" (as most of you accuse each other of doing - it's so obvious many of you have multiple logons - duh!). I, for one, won't even bother to read it.
Has it been a bad day?..

I really do hope you are right , and let's hope in 15 years time we have a fantastic town centre, full of great shops, great places to eat and a real pleasure to go to,
However we haven't seen any positive progress in the past 15 years, so please don't hold your breath.
As for free wifi, it was nothing that the good people of swindon did to see its collapse, it was a con from the start, and unfortunately once that happens, you just wait for the next one.
I really do hope it all goes as planned, and we the tax payer don't get strung along as we have been in the past
Who pays for forward swindon, and who set this company up, has anyone checked ???? Just a thought!!!!!
[quote][p][bold]madreeves[/bold] wrote: The level of negativity aimed at anything in this town is really extraordinary. And always the same people banging on about the same things all the time and desperately trying to make out there are ulterior motives for everything. Moan, moan, moan. GOD, YOU'RE ALL SOOOOO BORING!!! Why can't you just see this as a regeneration of a horrible, unsafe part of town into something better for the future, instead of all being armchair critics, piously sitting in your ivory towers, smugly spewing self-righteous opinionated drivel and lambasting projects before they even get underway? Anyone going to drag up the wi fi issue and try and crowbar it in here??? No, that scheme didn't work but, then, a few individuals made it their personal ambition not to allow it to work didn't they? No wonder this site only has about 6 people who regularly post (and even those can't get through a debate without resorting to pathetic little tit for tat spats amongst themselves). Any idea how boring it is to have to trawl past your playground c**p to find someone with something intelligent to say? No doubt you'll all pounce on this with a response that's either a) totally patronising b) plain rude or c) totally irrelevant. Well, huff and puff away and "fiddle those thumbs" (as most of you accuse each other of doing - it's so obvious many of you have multiple logons - duh!). I, for one, won't even bother to read it.[/p][/quote]Has it been a bad day?.. I really do hope you are right , and let's hope in 15 years time we have a fantastic town centre, full of great shops, great places to eat and a real pleasure to go to, However we haven't seen any positive progress in the past 15 years, so please don't hold your breath. As for free wifi, it was nothing that the good people of swindon did to see its collapse, it was a con from the start, and unfortunately once that happens, you just wait for the next one. I really do hope it all goes as planned, and we the tax payer don't get strung along as we have been in the past Who pays for forward swindon, and who set this company up, has anyone checked ???? Just a thought!!!!! Dickdock
  • Score: 4

6:43pm Thu 6 Mar 14

GrumpyLocal says...

Dickdock wrote:
Flogging a dead horse,
As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses,
I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!!
Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store
SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves,
Free wifi anyone!!!!!!
I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this,
With the tax payers payers footing the bill
From memory HoF were given stupidly low rent prices as an incentive to open their store in the Brunel centre as part of the redevelopment 20+ years ago. The agreement was that they would run a normal store there for a set period of time at vastly reduced rates with the hope that their presence in the centre would create a "pull" effect on other retailers bringing them in to the town centre too.
Sadly, as anyone could have told the council, the site they occupy is at the runt end of the town centre and as such had little effect on other shops in the centre. Even with the redevelopment of Wharf Green it is well out of the way of most footfall.
Once the low rent had come to an end, HoF were happy to downgrade the store to suit the area they were in and turned it in to a outlet shop. had the council or the Brunel Centre management argued, the chances are that HoF would simply have packed up & left, leaving a massive retail area to fill.
[quote][p][bold]Dickdock[/bold] wrote: Flogging a dead horse, As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses, I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!! Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves, Free wifi anyone!!!!!! I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this, With the tax payers payers footing the bill[/p][/quote]From memory HoF were given stupidly low rent prices as an incentive to open their store in the Brunel centre as part of the redevelopment 20+ years ago. The agreement was that they would run a normal store there for a set period of time at vastly reduced rates with the hope that their presence in the centre would create a "pull" effect on other retailers bringing them in to the town centre too. Sadly, as anyone could have told the council, the site they occupy is at the runt end of the town centre and as such had little effect on other shops in the centre. Even with the redevelopment of Wharf Green it is well out of the way of most footfall. Once the low rent had come to an end, HoF were happy to downgrade the store to suit the area they were in and turned it in to a outlet shop. had the council or the Brunel Centre management argued, the chances are that HoF would simply have packed up & left, leaving a massive retail area to fill. GrumpyLocal
  • Score: 3

7:08pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Dickdock says...

GrumpyLocal wrote:
Dickdock wrote:
Flogging a dead horse,
As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses,
I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!!
Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store
SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves,
Free wifi anyone!!!!!!
I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this,
With the tax payers payers footing the bill
From memory HoF were given stupidly low rent prices as an incentive to open their store in the Brunel centre as part of the redevelopment 20+ years ago. The agreement was that they would run a normal store there for a set period of time at vastly reduced rates with the hope that their presence in the centre would create a "pull" effect on other retailers bringing them in to the town centre too.
Sadly, as anyone could have told the council, the site they occupy is at the runt end of the town centre and as such had little effect on other shops in the centre. Even with the redevelopment of Wharf Green it is well out of the way of most footfall.
Once the low rent had come to an end, HoF were happy to downgrade the store to suit the area they were in and turned it in to a outlet shop. had the council or the Brunel Centre management argued, the chances are that HoF would simply have packed up & left, leaving a massive retail area to fill.
I wasn't aware that was the case,
But very true, it is the arse end of the town, but has direct access from the car park, the same as Debenhams has at the other end of town.
I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre,
This will always be the obstacle for designer shops moving of Swindon,
[quote][p][bold]GrumpyLocal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dickdock[/bold] wrote: Flogging a dead horse, As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses, I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!! Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves, Free wifi anyone!!!!!! I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this, With the tax payers payers footing the bill[/p][/quote]From memory HoF were given stupidly low rent prices as an incentive to open their store in the Brunel centre as part of the redevelopment 20+ years ago. The agreement was that they would run a normal store there for a set period of time at vastly reduced rates with the hope that their presence in the centre would create a "pull" effect on other retailers bringing them in to the town centre too. Sadly, as anyone could have told the council, the site they occupy is at the runt end of the town centre and as such had little effect on other shops in the centre. Even with the redevelopment of Wharf Green it is well out of the way of most footfall. Once the low rent had come to an end, HoF were happy to downgrade the store to suit the area they were in and turned it in to a outlet shop. had the council or the Brunel Centre management argued, the chances are that HoF would simply have packed up & left, leaving a massive retail area to fill.[/p][/quote]I wasn't aware that was the case, But very true, it is the arse end of the town, but has direct access from the car park, the same as Debenhams has at the other end of town. I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre, This will always be the obstacle for designer shops moving of Swindon, Dickdock
  • Score: 1

7:26pm Thu 6 Mar 14

GrumpyLocal says...

Dickdock wrote:
GrumpyLocal wrote:
Dickdock wrote:
Flogging a dead horse,
As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses,
I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!!
Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store
SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves,
Free wifi anyone!!!!!!
I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this,
With the tax payers payers footing the bill
From memory HoF were given stupidly low rent prices as an incentive to open their store in the Brunel centre as part of the redevelopment 20+ years ago. The agreement was that they would run a normal store there for a set period of time at vastly reduced rates with the hope that their presence in the centre would create a "pull" effect on other retailers bringing them in to the town centre too.
Sadly, as anyone could have told the council, the site they occupy is at the runt end of the town centre and as such had little effect on other shops in the centre. Even with the redevelopment of Wharf Green it is well out of the way of most footfall.
Once the low rent had come to an end, HoF were happy to downgrade the store to suit the area they were in and turned it in to a outlet shop. had the council or the Brunel Centre management argued, the chances are that HoF would simply have packed up & left, leaving a massive retail area to fill.
I wasn't aware that was the case,
But very true, it is the arse end of the town, but has direct access from the car park, the same as Debenhams has at the other end of town.
I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre,
This will always be the obstacle for designer shops moving of Swindon,
The theory is that the outlet shops are not allowed to sell current line items so there shouldn't be the possibility to buy the same item in both places at the same time (unless HoF are having an end-of-line clearout and the outlet get stock in "new").
Debenhams has the advantage of being surrounded by shops, on the route in from the bus station and the stops on Flemming Way + the huge amount of office workers walking past it everyday at lunch from the Tri-Center and other offices at that end of town.
Also since the opening of the Brunel North car-park, the footfall west of the bridge over Canal Walk has dropped dramatically hence the rapid turnover of shops in that area.
[quote][p][bold]Dickdock[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]GrumpyLocal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dickdock[/bold] wrote: Flogging a dead horse, As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses, I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!! Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves, Free wifi anyone!!!!!! I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this, With the tax payers payers footing the bill[/p][/quote]From memory HoF were given stupidly low rent prices as an incentive to open their store in the Brunel centre as part of the redevelopment 20+ years ago. The agreement was that they would run a normal store there for a set period of time at vastly reduced rates with the hope that their presence in the centre would create a "pull" effect on other retailers bringing them in to the town centre too. Sadly, as anyone could have told the council, the site they occupy is at the runt end of the town centre and as such had little effect on other shops in the centre. Even with the redevelopment of Wharf Green it is well out of the way of most footfall. Once the low rent had come to an end, HoF were happy to downgrade the store to suit the area they were in and turned it in to a outlet shop. had the council or the Brunel Centre management argued, the chances are that HoF would simply have packed up & left, leaving a massive retail area to fill.[/p][/quote]I wasn't aware that was the case, But very true, it is the arse end of the town, but has direct access from the car park, the same as Debenhams has at the other end of town. I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre, This will always be the obstacle for designer shops moving of Swindon,[/p][/quote]The theory is that the outlet shops are not allowed to sell current line items so there shouldn't be the possibility to buy the same item in both places at the same time (unless HoF are having an end-of-line clearout and the outlet get stock in "new"). Debenhams has the advantage of being surrounded by shops, on the route in from the bus station and the stops on Flemming Way + the huge amount of office workers walking past it everyday at lunch from the Tri-Center and other offices at that end of town. Also since the opening of the Brunel North car-park, the footfall west of the bridge over Canal Walk has dropped dramatically hence the rapid turnover of shops in that area. GrumpyLocal
  • Score: 1

7:48pm Thu 6 Mar 14

GalaxyMan says...

Zurich staff do know how an underpass works?!
Zurich staff do know how an underpass works?! GalaxyMan
  • Score: 2

9:42pm Thu 6 Mar 14

M4 by pass says...

Pure Fantasy, this attempt to spread the town centre from Fleming way to south of Regent Circus to Fleet Street with a tiny part under cover. We should have a Indoor centre next to town as in Cardiff, Bristol, Southampton, rReading and even Newbury.

What has Muse built where can we see a success of theirs?

Proposals with words such as shops, restaurants, and open public space, fill me with dread. A bus interchange how about a transport interchange to include train, ca,r taxi etc linking town with Outlet our main attraction, Old Town, Pipers Way, the Hospital, East and West Swindon.
Pure Fantasy, this attempt to spread the town centre from Fleming way to south of Regent Circus to Fleet Street with a tiny part under cover. We should have a Indoor centre next to town as in Cardiff, Bristol, Southampton, rReading and even Newbury. What has Muse built where can we see a success of theirs? Proposals with words such as shops, restaurants, and open public space, fill me with dread. A bus interchange how about a transport interchange to include train, ca,r taxi etc linking town with Outlet our main attraction, Old Town, Pipers Way, the Hospital, East and West Swindon. M4 by pass
  • Score: 1

10:06pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Dickdock says...

GrumpyLocal wrote:
Dickdock wrote:
GrumpyLocal wrote:
Dickdock wrote:
Flogging a dead horse,
As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses,
I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!!
Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store
SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves,
Free wifi anyone!!!!!!
I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this,
With the tax payers payers footing the bill
From memory HoF were given stupidly low rent prices as an incentive to open their store in the Brunel centre as part of the redevelopment 20+ years ago. The agreement was that they would run a normal store there for a set period of time at vastly reduced rates with the hope that their presence in the centre would create a "pull" effect on other retailers bringing them in to the town centre too.
Sadly, as anyone could have told the council, the site they occupy is at the runt end of the town centre and as such had little effect on other shops in the centre. Even with the redevelopment of Wharf Green it is well out of the way of most footfall.
Once the low rent had come to an end, HoF were happy to downgrade the store to suit the area they were in and turned it in to a outlet shop. had the council or the Brunel Centre management argued, the chances are that HoF would simply have packed up & left, leaving a massive retail area to fill.
I wasn't aware that was the case,
But very true, it is the arse end of the town, but has direct access from the car park, the same as Debenhams has at the other end of town.
I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre,
This will always be the obstacle for designer shops moving of Swindon,
The theory is that the outlet shops are not allowed to sell current line items so there shouldn't be the possibility to buy the same item in both places at the same time (unless HoF are having an end-of-line clearout and the outlet get stock in "new").
Debenhams has the advantage of being surrounded by shops, on the route in from the bus station and the stops on Flemming Way + the huge amount of office workers walking past it everyday at lunch from the Tri-Center and other offices at that end of town.
Also since the opening of the Brunel North car-park, the footfall west of the bridge over Canal Walk has dropped dramatically hence the rapid turnover of shops in that area.
Well as far as old stock and new stock, I would ask any normal guy in the street to tell me what is old stock and what is new stock, which is why the outlet centre is so succesful,
But other than that I agree that Debenhams as the prime position and HoF does not
I still do not believe that designer shops will come to Swindon, and this is mainly due to the Outlet centre,
Which as far as I am concerned, I would always shop at the outlet centre, and judging by how succesful it is I think the majority of people would do the same
[quote][p][bold]GrumpyLocal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dickdock[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]GrumpyLocal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dickdock[/bold] wrote: Flogging a dead horse, As I have said before, no decent shops will move to swindon untill SBC can demonstrate they are trying to get people to shop in the town, the people that are willing to spend money, the people who drive there cars to the town centre,not just people that travel to town on buses, I find it strange that SBC think about buses first, and cars second, just remind me who owns the local bus service!!! Whilst you have the outlet centre you will not attract decent shops to Swimdon, the example of this is house of Fraser, they could not compete with the outlet centre who sell designer labels at reduced prises, so they changed there store to a discounted goods store SBC , sounds like it has been taken in by MUSE, and forward thinking swindon or what ever they call themselves, Free wifi anyone!!!!!! I am sorry but someone needs to look into what is going on behind the scenes and who is being paid what and how much are us tax payers paying for all of this, because I feel there will be a scandal coming out of the back of all this, With the tax payers payers footing the bill[/p][/quote]From memory HoF were given stupidly low rent prices as an incentive to open their store in the Brunel centre as part of the redevelopment 20+ years ago. The agreement was that they would run a normal store there for a set period of time at vastly reduced rates with the hope that their presence in the centre would create a "pull" effect on other retailers bringing them in to the town centre too. Sadly, as anyone could have told the council, the site they occupy is at the runt end of the town centre and as such had little effect on other shops in the centre. Even with the redevelopment of Wharf Green it is well out of the way of most footfall. Once the low rent had come to an end, HoF were happy to downgrade the store to suit the area they were in and turned it in to a outlet shop. had the council or the Brunel Centre management argued, the chances are that HoF would simply have packed up & left, leaving a massive retail area to fill.[/p][/quote]I wasn't aware that was the case, But very true, it is the arse end of the town, but has direct access from the car park, the same as Debenhams has at the other end of town. I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre, This will always be the obstacle for designer shops moving of Swindon,[/p][/quote]The theory is that the outlet shops are not allowed to sell current line items so there shouldn't be the possibility to buy the same item in both places at the same time (unless HoF are having an end-of-line clearout and the outlet get stock in "new"). Debenhams has the advantage of being surrounded by shops, on the route in from the bus station and the stops on Flemming Way + the huge amount of office workers walking past it everyday at lunch from the Tri-Center and other offices at that end of town. Also since the opening of the Brunel North car-park, the footfall west of the bridge over Canal Walk has dropped dramatically hence the rapid turnover of shops in that area.[/p][/quote]Well as far as old stock and new stock, I would ask any normal guy in the street to tell me what is old stock and what is new stock, which is why the outlet centre is so succesful, But other than that I agree that Debenhams as the prime position and HoF does not I still do not believe that designer shops will come to Swindon, and this is mainly due to the Outlet centre, Which as far as I am concerned, I would always shop at the outlet centre, and judging by how succesful it is I think the majority of people would do the same Dickdock
  • Score: 0

10:12pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Eastern Badger says...

This was a really poor article from the point of view of journalism. A little cynicism would make the Advertiser sound less the SBC's PR department.

Where is the money, where are the tenants of the offices?

The Whalebridge junction is many accidents waiting to happen and will eventually make Swindon's planners famous. There was an accident there a couple of weekends ago involving ambulances yet no paper reports of quite how many have occurred.

You cannot give offices away in town for £4-5.00 per sq.ft yet Muse think they will let for £20?

So far it's all been public money (so councillors know that is our money) and more will now go on CPO's.

At least report the facts where you ask about them?
This was a really poor article from the point of view of journalism. A little cynicism would make the Advertiser sound less the SBC's PR department. Where is the money, where are the tenants of the offices? The Whalebridge junction is many accidents waiting to happen and will eventually make Swindon's planners famous. There was an accident there a couple of weekends ago involving ambulances yet no paper reports of quite how many have occurred. You cannot give offices away in town for £4-5.00 per sq.ft yet Muse think they will let for £20? So far it's all been public money (so councillors know that is our money) and more will now go on CPO's. At least report the facts where you ask about them? Eastern Badger
  • Score: 3

11:18pm Thu 6 Mar 14

Marketing man says...

Why are the out of town centres successful? They are easy to access and free to park. The only way that Swindon town centre will be a success is to bring in a fleet of JCBs and develop competition to Cabot Circus, Cribbs Causeway, Cheltenham, Reading and all the other covered in centres where people can shop in the dry and in comfort. Provide ample car parking and sensible access roads and attract the right tenants. What we have now is the most dis-jointed town. There is the Outlet Village, Greenbridge, Asda Walmart area, Mannington,etc which actually increases traffic as people have to drive from one area to another.

Marketingman
Why are the out of town centres successful? They are easy to access and free to park. The only way that Swindon town centre will be a success is to bring in a fleet of JCBs and develop competition to Cabot Circus, Cribbs Causeway, Cheltenham, Reading and all the other covered in centres where people can shop in the dry and in comfort. Provide ample car parking and sensible access roads and attract the right tenants. What we have now is the most dis-jointed town. There is the Outlet Village, Greenbridge, Asda Walmart area, Mannington,etc which actually increases traffic as people have to drive from one area to another. Marketingman Marketing man
  • Score: 2

1:08am Fri 7 Mar 14

CRANLEY says...

Will Fleming way have the capacity to take all the buses that currently use the bus station? Fleming way is already very full with Thamesdown Transport buses. And where will the taxi rank that is in the bus station go?
Will Fleming way have the capacity to take all the buses that currently use the bus station? Fleming way is already very full with Thamesdown Transport buses. And where will the taxi rank that is in the bus station go? CRANLEY
  • Score: 0

8:15am Fri 7 Mar 14

speaker2 says...

YEA YEA YEA....BLAH BLAH BLAH

People of Swindon have seen this all before for the last 20 or years
The Council states (We are doing up the Town Centre)

Proceeds to Hire some designers, we payout a shed load of money...The Drawing go missing, a meeting is held and we the people of Swindon have paid for nothing..
But what really gets me about this story, is the way they say "It will take 10 years to complete"
Really if you the council are going to do this then the whole Town center project could be completed in half that time.
10 years
Sorry but people of Swindon are we really going to stand for this utter bxxxxxx
YEA YEA YEA....BLAH BLAH BLAH People of Swindon have seen this all before for the last 20 or years The Council states (We are doing up the Town Centre) Proceeds to Hire some designers, we payout a shed load of money...The Drawing go missing, a meeting is held and we the people of Swindon have paid for nothing.. But what really gets me about this story, is the way they say "It will take 10 years to complete" Really if you the council are going to do this then the whole Town center project could be completed in half that time. 10 years Sorry but people of Swindon are we really going to stand for this utter bxxxxxx speaker2
  • Score: 2

10:11am Fri 7 Mar 14

FRANK D says...

Where will the buses go whilst they level Fleming Way? Sounds as if the town centre will be a place to avoid for a very long time.
Where will the buses go whilst they level Fleming Way? Sounds as if the town centre will be a place to avoid for a very long time. FRANK D
  • Score: 0

10:25am Fri 7 Mar 14

Oik1 says...

"I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre, "


And why would you go to the outlet centre when you could get the same jumper at an even better price on-line?
The internet is the future of much shopping, although town centres have a place, making them pay profits with a long term future is not / will not be so easy in this day and age, old and dirty town centres have had their day, too little too late, comes to mind, this regeneration is about 20 or more years too late.
"I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre, " And why would you go to the outlet centre when you could get the same jumper at an even better price on-line? The internet is the future of much shopping, although town centres have a place, making them pay profits with a long term future is not / will not be so easy in this day and age, old and dirty town centres have had their day, too little too late, comes to mind, this regeneration is about 20 or more years too late. Oik1
  • Score: 1

12:45pm Fri 7 Mar 14

Dickdock says...

Oik1 wrote:
"I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre, "


And why would you go to the outlet centre when you could get the same jumper at an even better price on-line?
The internet is the future of much shopping, although town centres have a place, making them pay profits with a long term future is not / will not be so easy in this day and age, old and dirty town centres have had their day, too little too late, comes to mind, this regeneration is about 20 or more years too late.
Call old fashioned, but I do like to look around the shops and see what I am going to buy,

But you are completely right, if the regeneration had started when they first talked about it, we would have a good shopping centre, but sadly as is normally the way with Swindon, it got left behind
[quote][p][bold]Oik1[/bold] wrote: "I just feel (and it is just my opinion) that why would you spend £100.00 on a Ralf Lauren jumper in HoF when you can buy the same jumper for £60.00 in the outlet centre, " And why would you go to the outlet centre when you could get the same jumper at an even better price on-line? The internet is the future of much shopping, although town centres have a place, making them pay profits with a long term future is not / will not be so easy in this day and age, old and dirty town centres have had their day, too little too late, comes to mind, this regeneration is about 20 or more years too late.[/p][/quote]Call old fashioned, but I do like to look around the shops and see what I am going to buy, But you are completely right, if the regeneration had started when they first talked about it, we would have a good shopping centre, but sadly as is normally the way with Swindon, it got left behind Dickdock
  • Score: 0

3:01pm Fri 7 Mar 14

Swindon_AOK says...

Eastern Badger wrote:
This was a really poor article from the point of view of journalism. A little cynicism would make the Advertiser sound less the SBC's PR department.

Where is the money, where are the tenants of the offices?

The Whalebridge junction is many accidents waiting to happen and will eventually make Swindon's planners famous. There was an accident there a couple of weekends ago involving ambulances yet no paper reports of quite how many have occurred.

You cannot give offices away in town for £4-5.00 per sq.ft yet Muse think they will let for £20?

So far it's all been public money (so councillors know that is our money) and more will now go on CPO's.

At least report the facts where you ask about them?
Agree the article is poor (as always as they just report the 'facts' and never question anything) however you are off track about the office rents.

The biggets reason why rents are so low in the town centre is the quality of stock. Take Aspen House for example, SBC eventually agreed to buy it as it was beyond economic refurbishment. All these empty offices are ill equiped for 21st century business and to expensive to refurbish.

The idea is simply 'build it and they will come' in terms of providing high quality offices fit for high tech firms.

The massive error once again by the Council, is encouraging out of town development yet again at the expense of the centre.

SO we are told that Kimmerfields is being marketed to retail/commercial as well as corporate office space. And yet the one retailer that has the potential to regenerate the town centre - John Lewis - is allowed to open a store at Mannington in direct contradiction to their stated policy.

You have seen what happened once John Lewis opened there - it pulled up the whole site and resulted in a total transformation of the park.

Well if SBC had offered a peppercorn rent to John Lewis to open a full store at Kimmerfields we would have a fighting chance of making it work.

As it is they have blown it yet again as JL will never open a full store now they have the At Home branch......
[quote][p][bold]Eastern Badger[/bold] wrote: This was a really poor article from the point of view of journalism. A little cynicism would make the Advertiser sound less the SBC's PR department. Where is the money, where are the tenants of the offices? The Whalebridge junction is many accidents waiting to happen and will eventually make Swindon's planners famous. There was an accident there a couple of weekends ago involving ambulances yet no paper reports of quite how many have occurred. You cannot give offices away in town for £4-5.00 per sq.ft yet Muse think they will let for £20? So far it's all been public money (so councillors know that is our money) and more will now go on CPO's. At least report the facts where you ask about them?[/p][/quote]Agree the article is poor (as always as they just report the 'facts' and never question anything) however you are off track about the office rents. The biggets reason why rents are so low in the town centre is the quality of stock. Take Aspen House for example, SBC eventually agreed to buy it as it was beyond economic refurbishment. All these empty offices are ill equiped for 21st century business and to expensive to refurbish. The idea is simply 'build it and they will come' in terms of providing high quality offices fit for high tech firms. The massive error once again by the Council, is encouraging out of town development yet again at the expense of the centre. SO we are told that Kimmerfields is being marketed to retail/commercial as well as corporate office space. And yet the one retailer that has the potential to regenerate the town centre - John Lewis - is allowed to open a store at Mannington in direct contradiction to their stated policy. You have seen what happened once John Lewis opened there - it pulled up the whole site and resulted in a total transformation of the park. Well if SBC had offered a peppercorn rent to John Lewis to open a full store at Kimmerfields we would have a fighting chance of making it work. As it is they have blown it yet again as JL will never open a full store now they have the At Home branch...... Swindon_AOK
  • Score: 2

3:06pm Fri 7 Mar 14

Wiltshireman says...

Wow £350m to bulldooze the town centrre and build a new car park. That has to be some sized car park. .. No one else / outlets will take the shops or outlets so it has to be a Car Park

Yes I am taking the p1ss because this town has got a council who only think of what can they get financially for themselves into thier own pockets.

Glad I am now only a visitor and an ex pat.

RIP OFF Swindon ... RIP OFF Great Britain.

Good bye for ever. Never to return
Wow £350m to bulldooze the town centrre and build a new car park. That has to be some sized car park. .. No one else / outlets will take the shops or outlets so it has to be a Car Park Yes I am taking the p1ss because this town has got a council who only think of what can they get financially for themselves into thier own pockets. Glad I am now only a visitor and an ex pat. RIP OFF Swindon ... RIP OFF Great Britain. Good bye for ever. Never to return Wiltshireman
  • Score: 1

11:26pm Fri 7 Mar 14

Eastern Badger says...

Swindon_AOK wrote:
Eastern Badger wrote:
This was a really poor article from the point of view of journalism. A little cynicism would make the Advertiser sound less the SBC's PR department.

Where is the money, where are the tenants of the offices?

The Whalebridge junction is many accidents waiting to happen and will eventually make Swindon's planners famous. There was an accident there a couple of weekends ago involving ambulances yet no paper reports of quite how many have occurred.

You cannot give offices away in town for £4-5.00 per sq.ft yet Muse think they will let for £20?

So far it's all been public money (so councillors know that is our money) and more will now go on CPO's.

At least report the facts where you ask about them?
Agree the article is poor (as always as they just report the 'facts' and never question anything) however you are off track about the office rents.

The biggets reason why rents are so low in the town centre is the quality of stock. Take Aspen House for example, SBC eventually agreed to buy it as it was beyond economic refurbishment. All these empty offices are ill equiped for 21st century business and to expensive to refurbish.

The idea is simply 'build it and they will come' in terms of providing high quality offices fit for high tech firms.

The massive error once again by the Council, is encouraging out of town development yet again at the expense of the centre.

SO we are told that Kimmerfields is being marketed to retail/commercial as well as corporate office space. And yet the one retailer that has the potential to regenerate the town centre - John Lewis - is allowed to open a store at Mannington in direct contradiction to their stated policy.

You have seen what happened once John Lewis opened there - it pulled up the whole site and resulted in a total transformation of the park.

Well if SBC had offered a peppercorn rent to John Lewis to open a full store at Kimmerfields we would have a fighting chance of making it work.

As it is they have blown it yet again as JL will never open a full store now they have the At Home branch......
You are right about the policy - the new 'District Centre' at the Eastern Villages will also pull people away from town centre just like the very popular Orbital Park does in North Swindon. They are claiming on one hand that people in the new developments won't need to create external trips then on the other hand that they will still (for some reason) want to negotiate the car unfriendly routes into the town. They tried the encourage a retailer into town with House of Fraser but it failed as they didn't do much more afterwards. The Debenhams building us an eyesore as you drive into town yet not even covered in Kimmerfields application. Have you seen how far the new Waitrose is from the built homes at Wichelstowe? That will be external trips too then.
[quote][p][bold]Swindon_AOK[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Eastern Badger[/bold] wrote: This was a really poor article from the point of view of journalism. A little cynicism would make the Advertiser sound less the SBC's PR department. Where is the money, where are the tenants of the offices? The Whalebridge junction is many accidents waiting to happen and will eventually make Swindon's planners famous. There was an accident there a couple of weekends ago involving ambulances yet no paper reports of quite how many have occurred. You cannot give offices away in town for £4-5.00 per sq.ft yet Muse think they will let for £20? So far it's all been public money (so councillors know that is our money) and more will now go on CPO's. At least report the facts where you ask about them?[/p][/quote]Agree the article is poor (as always as they just report the 'facts' and never question anything) however you are off track about the office rents. The biggets reason why rents are so low in the town centre is the quality of stock. Take Aspen House for example, SBC eventually agreed to buy it as it was beyond economic refurbishment. All these empty offices are ill equiped for 21st century business and to expensive to refurbish. The idea is simply 'build it and they will come' in terms of providing high quality offices fit for high tech firms. The massive error once again by the Council, is encouraging out of town development yet again at the expense of the centre. SO we are told that Kimmerfields is being marketed to retail/commercial as well as corporate office space. And yet the one retailer that has the potential to regenerate the town centre - John Lewis - is allowed to open a store at Mannington in direct contradiction to their stated policy. You have seen what happened once John Lewis opened there - it pulled up the whole site and resulted in a total transformation of the park. Well if SBC had offered a peppercorn rent to John Lewis to open a full store at Kimmerfields we would have a fighting chance of making it work. As it is they have blown it yet again as JL will never open a full store now they have the At Home branch......[/p][/quote]You are right about the policy - the new 'District Centre' at the Eastern Villages will also pull people away from town centre just like the very popular Orbital Park does in North Swindon. They are claiming on one hand that people in the new developments won't need to create external trips then on the other hand that they will still (for some reason) want to negotiate the car unfriendly routes into the town. They tried the encourage a retailer into town with House of Fraser but it failed as they didn't do much more afterwards. The Debenhams building us an eyesore as you drive into town yet not even covered in Kimmerfields application. Have you seen how far the new Waitrose is from the built homes at Wichelstowe? That will be external trips too then. Eastern Badger
  • Score: 0

11:58am Sat 8 Mar 14

M4 by pass says...

PS do Sainsburys only stay in Brunel because they get a heavily discounted rent/ business rates etc If so this is very unfair competition to the independents.
PS do Sainsburys only stay in Brunel because they get a heavily discounted rent/ business rates etc If so this is very unfair competition to the independents. M4 by pass
  • Score: 0

9:23pm Thu 27 Mar 14

darrey80 says...

StillPav wrote:
it does seem very strange that businesses are increasingly re-locating out of the town centre to out-of-town offices, while at the same time there are plans to build thousands of sqaure feet of new office space in town.
Relocating out because of the quality of the offices in the town, the out of town are newer and fit for purpose. Swindon has an edge over rivals such as Reading and Bristol which are significantly more expensive. There is need for Swindon office space - for example there are many Civil engineering firms and a key client is Network rail whose South-West headquarters is in Swindon. More consultants want to start offices here too.
[quote][p][bold]StillPav[/bold] wrote: it does seem very strange that businesses are increasingly re-locating out of the town centre to out-of-town offices, while at the same time there are plans to build thousands of sqaure feet of new office space in town.[/p][/quote]Relocating out because of the quality of the offices in the town, the out of town are newer and fit for purpose. Swindon has an edge over rivals such as Reading and Bristol which are significantly more expensive. There is need for Swindon office space - for example there are many Civil engineering firms and a key client is Network rail whose South-West headquarters is in Swindon. More consultants want to start offices here too. darrey80
  • Score: 0

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